Hello,
I have a t2 MRI image that is centered around the thoracic vertebra and I would like to create a file that has the vertebra labeled so that I can calculate the CSA.
Also I have a t2s MRI image that I would to calculate the CSA of the entire area along with the gray and white matter.
Attached is a file of the commands that I have run, but have been unsuccessful except for creating a segmented t2 image.
Thank you,
Sarah
Hi Sarah,
So, I’ve looked at your images, and I wrote a series of commands to compute CSA at specific vertebral levels:
# Tested with SCT v4.2.1
# Segment the spinal cord
sct_deepseg_sc -i t2.nii.gz -c t2 -qc qc
# Label vertebrae, knowing that the Z=179 axial slice corresponds to the T10-T11 disc (label value "17")
sct_label_vertebrae -i t2.nii.gz -s t2_seg.nii.gz -c t2 -initz 179,17 -qc qc
# Compute CSA at levels T7 to T12 (and average within each level)
sct_process_segmentation -i t2_seg.nii.gz -vertfile t2_seg_labeled.nii.gz -vert 14:19 -perlevel 1 -o CSA_T2w.csv
Here is the QC report: qc.zip (973.6 KB) and the output CSV file: CSA_T2w.csv (3.0 KB) so you will be able to compare on your end.
A few things to note:
-initcenter from sct_label_vertebrae only works if a disc (not a mid-level body) is centered in the FOV. Which is why I used the more hand-crafted -initz flag. In the future, if you acquire your subjects by centering the FOV at a disc, you can better automatize the analysis script.-initcenter is shifted by one, due to a bug in the code. A ticket has been opened here. Once the issue is solved, you just have to increase the value by one.
cheers,
julien
Hello Julien,
With regards to the ‘no visible WM/GM contrast’, is there an issue with how the t2 scans (t2 and t2s) were collected? Is there something that can be done to fix this problem?
Sarah
Hi Sarah,
It is known to be very difficult to acquire good-quality images in the thoracic cord, especially for visualizing WM/GM contrast. There are some discussions on that topic in the MRI Acquisition Forum. Please feel free to contribute/comment on the forum.
Best,
Julien
Hello Julien,
I was able to implement the parameters from the text doc you sent me and have new t2s images. Are the images attached better quality to be able to extract gray and white matter? If so what is the best way to extract gray and white matter along with CSA from the image?
Saraht2s.nii.gz (3.1 MB)
Hi,
Yes, it is better, but still not enough for a reliable segmentation. CNR is low (you might want to add averaging). See below, I was only able to automatically segment one slice:
Even with the naked eyes it is difficult to see where the gray matter is. As a rule of thumb: if a human cannot do it, a computer will not be able to 
So, you might want to try the acquisition parameters proposed by [Yiannakas et al. PLOS One 2014].
Hello,
What do you mean you might want to add averaging?
Sarah
Increase your nex (ie repeat acquisition and average in kspace)
Hello Julien,
I have recently scanned someone add increased the nex and it made the images a lot cleaner. Thank you for your suggestions.
For the t2 image I have manually labeled the vertebrae and created a file with those points. When I go to extract the CSA from the t2_seg file I am only given values for that specific point I created not the average from one point to the next. What am I doing wrong? Attached is my code.
batch_processing.sh (2.8 KB)
Sarah
Hi Sarah,
You get a value per point because you’ve inputed labels_vert_1.nii.gz as the vertfile (and this file has effectively a single pixel per level). What you want to do is create a labeled segmentation from your manual points, and then use that labeled segmentation to average per level.
Here is how to do it: batch_processing_20200331-150851.sh (1.9 KB)
Note, I removed the registration to template as it is not required here (it saves you time).
Hi Julien,
Thank you. It worked perfectly. That is exactly what I wanted, a file with labeled segmentation from my manual points.
Is it possible to find the gray and white matter with this file or is it not because you are unable to visibly see the contrast?
Sarah
I believe you have not shared the new file (i.e. with more average) with me so I cannot tell
Sorry for not attaching the image to the previous message. Attached is the t2s to determine if gray and white matter CSA can be pulled out.
t2s.nii.gz (3.4 MB)
I am also trying to pull MTR from the below files, but when I get to the point of putting the values into an Excel sheet the values are similar between white matter and the corticospinal tracts.
mt1.nii.gz (1.3 MB)
mt0.nii.gz (1.3 MB)
sct_get_centerline -i mt1.nii.gz -c t2
sct_create_mask -i mt1.nii.gz -p centerline,mt1_centerline.nii.gz -size 45mm
sct_crop_image -i mt1.nii.gz -m mask_mt1.nii.gz -o mt1_crop.nii.gz
sct_deepseg_sc -i mt1_crop.nii.gz -c t2 -qc qc
sct_register_multimodal -i mt0.nii.gz -d mt1_crop.nii.gz -dseg mt1_crop_seg.nii.gz -param step=1,type=im,algo=rigid,slicewise=1,metric=CC -x spline -qc qc
sct_register_multimodal -i $SCT_DIR/data/PAM50/template/PAM50_t2.nii.gz -iseg $SCT_DIR/data/PAM50/template/PAM50_cord.nii.gz -d mt1_crop.nii.gz -dseg mt1_crop_seg.nii.gz -param step=1,type=seg,algo=slicereg,smooth=3:step=2,type=seg,algo=bsplinesyn,slicewise=1,iter=3 -initwarp …/t2/warp_template2anat.nii.gz -initwarpinv …/t2/warp_anat2template.nii.gz
mv warp_PAM50_t22mt1_crop.nii.gz warp_template2mt.nii.gz
mv warp_mt1_crop2PAM50_t2.nii.gz warp_mt2template.nii.gz
sct_warp_template -d mt1_crop.nii.gz -w warp_template2mt.nii.gz -qc qc
sct_compute_mtr -mt0 mt0_reg.nii.gz -mt1 mt1_crop.nii.gz
sct_extract_metric -i mtr.nii.gz -method map -l 51 -o mtr_in_wm.csv
sct_extract_metric -i mtr.nii.gz -method map -l 52 -o mtr_in_gm.csv
sct_extract_metric -i mtr.nii.gz -method map -l 4 -o mtr_in_left_lateral_corticospinal_tract.csv
sct_extract_metric -i mtr.nii.gz -method map -l 5 -o mtr_in_right_lateral_corticospinal_tract.csv
The corticospinal tract being in the WM, it is not surprising that values would be similar.
Looking at your file t2s.nii.gz, I think the quality is good enough to try the automatic GM segmentation. You can always manually adjust it.
WM takes up a larger region than a specific tract so wouldn’t the sum of all the tracts (within the WM region) equal to the value given for the WM?
That would be a valid argument if you were to compute CSA, but here you are extracting MTR (i.e. take the average metric value) within one region included in another region.
Analogously, if you were to average two pixels of value 5 and 100 pixels of value 5, both averages would be 5.
Oh that makes sense. Thank you
Julien,
I am trying to obtain the GM, WM, and total CSA using the t2s I sent you. Since I am subtracting the GM from the segmented area, the GM CSA values added to the WM CSA values should equal the segmented CSA values. In my Excel output files they do not. I extracted the CSA values for all 14 slices and am including the Excel sheets. The code I am using is below.
sct_deepseg_sc -i t2s.nii.gz -c t2s -qc qc
sct_deepseg_gm -i t2s.nii.gz -qc qc
sct_maths -i t2s_seg.nii.gz -sub t2s_gmseg.nii.gz -o t2s_wmseg.nii.gz
sct_process_segmentation -i t2s_wmseg.nii.gz -o csa_wm.csv
sct_process_segmentation -i t2s_gmseg.nii.gz -o csa_gm.csv
sct_process_segmentation -i t2s_seg.nii.gz -o csa_total.csv
t2s: t2s.nii.gz (2.3 MB)
csa_gm.csv (4.3 KB)
csa_total.csv (4.5 KB)
csa_wm.csv (4.5 KB)
hi,
a few things:
sct_process_segmentation, you might end up with small errors. You can use the flag -angle-corr 0 to turn off angle correction. More info can be found in the SCT course.In the future, could you please post new questions in a new thread? The title of this thread is “Thoracic spine t2 vertebral labeling”, and this new question does not reflect the title (could be confusing for other users, and for my own organization when trying to catch up with users’ issues). Thank you for your understanding.